Gah, Im never buying a PC game again

Scythe

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Let my tell you a little story, if you are willing to listen...er...read.

I like fantasy and roleplay (obviously) and I loved the pc game known as Neverwinter Nights. Naturally, I was interested in Neverwinter Nights 2. Now, my computer is by no means a powerful machine, but on their site it was mentioned that performance would be no issue (i did online benchmark test, and read the list of minimum requirements). Especially my geforce 5900 card would be an issue, i assumed, but on their site (prior to the release) there was a post saying that the game supported all the way down to 5400 cards. Neverwinter Nights 2 was made by a different developer. Some of my friends noted that the game might be a bit disappointing. How prophetic they were.

When I purchased it, the box stated as requirement on the back of the case a 128 mb 3d card, which I have. When I came home, I went to the official forums to check things out. That's when I was shocked. There were tons of people complaining about poor performance, and bugs, and whatnot. Looking at the supported list again, i noted that some cards were 'scrapped', and the list now only went down to 5600 cards. That's life.

Installing the game and playing. At the very minimum settings, and with pretty much every other program disabled (virus scan, firewall... networking service :unsure: ) I had terrible frame rate (about 9-15 outdoors and 0.5-6 indoors... standing still). That's life.

On the forums, things had pretty much exploded. Everyone was asking about the performance, with one developer response in 4 days, saying they were looking into it. New patch released, a little improvement. Checked the 3d card list, more removed, including my own 5900. That's life.

After spending the last days tweaking and messing with my computer in vain, I decided to give up. I gave the game away. I also posted on the forums asking a bit of explanation (trying to remain civil... or at least more civil than the others). THAT is life....

You see, it turns out the moderators there, though you would expect them to remain professional, are just laughing at the people. Please, allow me to show you a moderate example of their behaviour and respect for the paying customers:

Since release, I have been busiest setting fire and acid to trolls, then responding to PMs of various sort that run the gamut of:


* Where can I download patch X.xxx?
* Do you know why my system won't run NWN2?
* What sort of rig do I need to play the game?
* Waaah, you closed my thread!
* Waaah, you didn't reopen my thread!
* Waaah, you're being mean to me!
* Waaah, someone else is being mean to me!
* Sorry, didn't mean to sound angry, really.
* How come you guys are such Nazi Gestapo moderators?
* Where are you guys, we need moderator support to kill some trolls.

....

Some of you, however, are still not "getting" it in some ways. The many times that I have seen some people posting about having trouble with 5XXX series cards, you have to read the sticky about graphics cards and perhaps do a little research-- those cards just aren't going to make it. As to the 7300 series, especially the LE versions, they were not really meant for even average level gaming when they came out, so this game is going to fry your cards (not literally, but it might as well be.)

Charming fellow, isn't he? I mean, come on, he even said 'waaah'...

That post made me really mad. I felt ripped off, just like hundreds of people before me. I made a complaining post, asking about the 'fixing' of the 3d card list, and they simply replied like this:

I am sorry to hear about your problems, but you are just wrong about your data. The 5XXX series of cards was dropped at least two full months prior to release. If you feel otherwise, then I can only repeat your quote of my earlier quote: Unfortunately some of the posters here are still not getting it. The 5xxx series of cards was never really meant for serious gaming in the first place and they were removed from the list at least two months prior to release. The fact that it was still on the box was -- oops, wait, the box *(you know the thing the game that is released comes in? Kind of squarish, rectangular a bit, Height, length, width, that the DVD or CD comes inside of when you buy the game?) doesn't say anything about the 5xxx series so you must be right and I am wrong. Or is it the other way around?

I take the time to respond to this as there is just no basis for your point as the facts go. This doesn't change that I am sorry that you are having trouble. However, if you are still having trouble and are still hanging onto a card 3 generations older than the game, then the problem is simple in your case to resolve: get a new card. Of course, there are a few others out there who are using such a card and getting what they feel are respectable results, considering they know the card isn't meant to cut the mustard with this game (or any others out in the last two years or so-- if they do, you're extremely fortunate.)

That's nice. Take time to note his friendly explanation of the box. Remember how I said that the box only stated a 128MB card? Yeah. Actually, while the game came just in a dvd case, the preordered special edition came in a box. Turns out they assume everyone likes to pay extra. Strangely enough, the topic was locked before I could reply again. So there it is. 50 bucks down the drain. That's life.


So, what have I learned:

-The customer is not always right, even when he is.
-As soon as a company has their/your money, they don't care what happens next, and they're not afraid to show it.
-Some companies like to fix a lack of respect with a bigger lack of respect.
-Some companies aren't ashamed to 'fix' their flaws by lying about past data
-Arguing on the internet really IS like running in the special olympics

To make a long (and boring, I am sure) story short, I am never buying a pc game again. :(

PS: if this post offended you in any way, I apologise. Except if you work for Obsidian "Entertainment", in which case sod off.
 

thesassycynic

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(Sadly) I read the whole thing. That really sucks, but what can you do, ya know? They're not going to stop being assholes and you've already paid for the game so they're not worried about losing money. Sorry it happened to you (especially since it's a game you really like). Like you said, c'est la vie. :ermm:
 

logan01

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I read every sad word. I hope you paid with a credit card (Cancel Payment!). Even if the 30 day grace period has passed, in so many cases, your card provider will "eat" the charge. The card providers usually conduct a fairly rapid investigation and if they decide in your favor, they credit your account and go "balls to the wall" after the guilty party. Additonally, if you did this over the internet, the FBI has a site within fbi.gov for you to turn the jerks in. If they're a U.S. site, they can deal with them. Save all your correspondance and provide it to those who will help eliminate this garbage in the future. If you did PayPal, they'll take away their "paypal license" if everything you say is accurate (I don't doubt you). You have a lot of options to (1) get your money back and (2) stop the a*#holes from doing it to others. Let us know if you do anything. I had 2 experiences this past summer and my Visa folks accepted my explanation and credited my account. After going to that FBI site and inputting my situation, they took it and it is currently being investigated. Believe or not, there are some real serious federal laws which target illegal e-commerce practices. Sorry it happened. Good Luck. The below url is the internet crime unit you may want to visit.

http://www.ic3.gov/
 

Scythe

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Originally posted by logan01@Dec 18 2006, 08:18 PM
I read every sad word. I hope you paid with a credit card (Cancel Payment!). Even if the 30 day grace period has passed, in so many cases, your card provider will "eat" the charge. Additonally, if you did this over the internet, the FBI has a site within fbi.gov for you to turn the jerks in. If they're a U.S. site, they can deal with them. Save all your correspondance and provide it to those who will help eliminate this garbage in the future. If you did PayPal, they'll take away their "paypal license" if everything you say is accurate (I don't doubt you). You have a lot of options to (1) get your money back and (2) stop the a*#holes from doing it to others. Let us know if you do anything. I had 2 experiences this past summer and my Visa folks accepted my explanation and credited my account. After going to that FBI site and inputting my situation, they took it and it is currently being investigated. Believe or not, there are some real serious federal laws which target illegal e-commerce practices. Sorry it happened. Good Luck.
Well, some people are already starting a petition to get their money back.

Though, since I gave my version to my brother Im not interested in a refund. Im just angry with those people for not their attitude.
 

proof

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The 5xxx series of cards was never really meant for serious gaming in the first place and they were removed from the list at least two months prior to release.

If the 5xxx series cards were never really meant for serious gaming, then why were they on the list in the first place? Did they originally intend for the graphics to be shitty?

Screw them.
 

Scythe

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Originally posted by proof@Dec 19 2006, 01:30 AM
The 5xxx series of cards was never really meant for serious gaming in the first place and they were removed from the list at least two months prior to release.

If the 5xxx series cards were never really meant for serious gaming, then why were they on the list in the first place? Did they originally intend for the graphics to be shitty?

Screw them.
And, to be exact, you should only look at the last 3 digits to see what it was MADE FOR...in nvidias case anyway

anything x100-x300 is made for office stuff like presentations. Cards that are x400-x600 are made for general gaming and Cards like x700 and x900 are cards made for bragging, mostly.

The first digit is just the series.

But meh
 

4swrds

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Originally posted by Scythe@Dec 18 2006, 12:15 PM
Let my tell you a little story, if you are willing to listen...er...read.

I like fantasy and roleplay (obviously) and I loved the pc game known as Neverwinter Nights. Naturally, I was interested in Neverwinter Nights 2. Now, my computer is by no means a powerful machine, but on their site it was mentioned that performance would be no issue (i did online benchmark test, and read the list of minimum requirements). Especially my geforce 5900 card would be an issue, i assumed, but on their site (prior to the release) there was a post saying that the game supported all the way down to 5400 cards. Neverwinter Nights 2 was made by a different developer. Some of my friends noted that the game might be a bit disappointing. How prophetic they were.

When I purchased it, the box stated as requirement on the back of the case a 128 mb 3d card, which I have. When I came home, I went to the official forums to check things out. That's when I was shocked. There were tons of people complaining about poor performance, and bugs, and whatnot. Looking at the supported list again, i noted that some cards were 'scrapped', and the list now only went down to 5600 cards. That's life.

Installing the game and playing. At the very minimum settings, and with pretty much every other program disabled (virus scan, firewall... networking service :unsure: ) I had terrible frame rate (about 9-15 outdoors and 0.5-6 indoors... standing still). That's life.

On the forums, things had pretty much exploded. Everyone was asking about the performance, with one developer response in 4 days, saying they were looking into it. New patch released, a little improvement. Checked the 3d card list, more removed, including my own 5900. That's life.

After spending the last days tweaking and messing with my computer in vain, I decided to give up. I gave the game away. I also posted on the forums asking a bit of explanation (trying to remain civil... or at least more civil than the others). THAT is life....

You see, it turns out the moderators there, though you would expect them to remain professional, are just laughing at the people. Please, allow me to show you a moderate example of their behaviour and respect for the paying customers:

Since release, I have been busiest setting fire and acid to trolls, then responding to PMs of various sort that run the gamut of:


    * Where can I download patch X.xxx?
    * Do you know why my system won't run NWN2?
    * What sort of rig do I need to play the game?
    * Waaah, you closed my thread!
    * Waaah, you didn't reopen my thread!
    * Waaah, you're being mean to me!
    * Waaah, someone else is being mean to me!
    * Sorry, didn't mean to sound angry, really.
    * How come you guys are such Nazi Gestapo moderators?
    * Where are you guys, we need moderator support to kill some trolls.

....

Some of you, however, are still not "getting" it in some ways. The many times that I have seen some people posting about having trouble with 5XXX series cards, you have to read the sticky about graphics cards and perhaps do a little research-- those cards just aren't going to make it. As to the 7300 series, especially the LE versions, they were not really meant for even average level gaming when they came out, so this game is going to fry your cards (not literally, but it might as well be.)

Charming fellow, isn't he? I mean, come on, he even said 'waaah'...

That post made me really mad. I felt ripped off, just like hundreds of people before me. I made a complaining post, asking about the 'fixing' of the 3d card list, and they simply replied like this:

I am sorry to hear about your problems, but you are just wrong about your data. The 5XXX series of cards was dropped at least two full months prior to release. If you feel otherwise, then I can only repeat your quote of my earlier quote: Unfortunately some of the posters here are still not getting it. The 5xxx series of cards was never really meant for serious gaming in the first place and they were removed from the list at least two months prior to release. The fact that it was still on the box was -- oops, wait, the box *(you know the thing the game that is released comes in? Kind of squarish, rectangular a bit, Height, length, width, that the DVD or CD comes inside of when you buy the game?) doesn't say anything about the 5xxx series so you must be right and I am wrong. Or is it the other way around?

I take the time to respond to this as there is just no basis for your point as the facts go. This doesn't change that I am sorry that you are having trouble. However, if you are still having trouble and are still hanging onto a card 3 generations older than the game, then the problem is simple in your case to resolve: get a new card. Of course, there are a few others out there who are using such a card and getting what they feel are respectable results, considering they know the card isn't meant to cut the mustard with this game (or any others out in the last two years or so-- if they do, you're extremely fortunate.)

That's nice. Take time to note his friendly explanation of the box. Remember how I said that the box only stated a 128MB card? Yeah. Actually, while the game came just in a dvd case, the preordered special edition came in a box. Turns out they assume everyone likes to pay extra. Strangely enough, the topic was locked before I could reply again. So there it is. 50 bucks down the drain. That's life.


So, what have I learned:

-The customer is not always right, even when he is.
-As soon as a company has their/your money, they don't care what happens next, and they're not afraid to show it.
-Some companies like to fix a lack of respect with a bigger lack of respect.
-Some companies aren't ashamed to 'fix' their flaws by lying about past data
-Arguing on the internet really IS like running in the special olympics

To make a long (and boring, I am sure) story short, I am never buying a pc game again. :(

PS: if this post offended you in any way, I apologise. Except if you work for Obsidian "Entertainment", in which case sod off.
TLDR...
 

cultclassic

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Originally posted by Scythe@Dec 18 2006, 02:25 PM
Well, some people are already starting a petition to get their money back.

Though, since I gave my version to my brother Im not interested in a refund. Im just angry with those people for not their attitude.
I think you should complain to the credit card people anyway; if not for you, for hte sake of other people... That way when others complain, they get refunds faster . When I made a complaint about MCI long distance, the cc company gave a refund immediately because MCI was a known offender.... ;)
 

Scythe

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Well, from what I heard, there isnt much of a complaint. Cuz, even if we COULD prove em wrong and prove, somehow, that those cards n stuff were supported, the playability of a slideshow isnt really defined... hence, they never really broke any promises or failed to deliver paid services.

Its been tried in the past for other stuff.
 
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